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  1. #1
    Junior Member Northman's Avatar
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    Default 1k NATURAL waterstone?

    Hi all,

    I've been putting my hones through their paces, trying to become adept at sharpening up e-bay specials, etc. So far, I've tried diamond, nortons (4/8k combo) and a combo coticule. I greatly prefer the coticule to all of the others, even though it cuts a little bit slower (it's a medium hardness coti). Are there any good ~1k natural waterstones for bevel setting/correction that provide a similar experience as a coti or other natural stone? Speed isn't crucial, I just prefer the experience and mystique of using old-timey hones.

    Northman

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    At this point in time... gssixgun's Avatar
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    There are some Japanese stones that qualify and some people even use their Coticule with a HEAVY slurry to bevel set also

    Start with this thread Japanese Natural Waterstone (400-800 ??)

    There are quite a few threads about Natural bevel setters, but if you read most, the prevailing theme is 'Yes it can be done and it is "fun" but not optimal"

    The 1k synthetics dominate this area of honing as they are "Cheap" and very very good at it
    Last edited by gssixgun; 08-12-2011 at 09:00 AM.

    "No amount of money spent on a Stone can ever replace the value of the time it takes learning to use it properly"
    Very Respectfully - Glen

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    Admin & Forum fixer Bruno's Avatar
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    Even Japanese sword polishers (not exactly known for throwing tradition in the wind) use synthetics for low grit polishing stages. They are better, faster and cheaper. And what is equally important: you can still get them, as many of them as you need.
    Ulfberth Ulfberth, sword of a master - Whistling death as I swing thee faster
    Ulfberth Ulfberth, spin like a wheel - Dealing death, steel you feel

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    I Bleed Slurry Disburden's Avatar
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    You can ask Maksim what Jnat he has around that would be good for a bevel setter/1-2K type of stone. I am sure he knows a lot and will let you know...worth the wait if you're into Japanese stones.

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    Master of insanity Scipio's Avatar
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    There is also the Dalmore Blue, said to be around 2-4K level.

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    I used Nakayamas for my house mainaman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Disburden View Post
    You can ask Maksim what Jnat he has around that would be good for a bevel setter/1-2K type of stone. I am sure he knows a lot and will let you know...worth the wait if you're into Japanese stones.
    To my experience no such stone exist that is good for razors, they are either too slow or can damage the edge.
    The closest one to a bevel setter ,I have tried, is Aizu which is fast enough to do the job, but as the most low grit Jnats it tends to release particles that cause micro chipping. Aoto might be a decent substitute but the readily available ones have a lot of toxic inclusions and lines and in general are not that fast to chose over synthetic 1k.
    Stefan

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    what Dad calls me nun2sharp's Avatar
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    Japanese Amakusa, approximately at 1-2 k level. Some steels it likes and some it does not.
    It is easier to fool people than to convince them they have been fooled. Twain

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    iyo japanese stone. Interesting to use, but not as effective as synthetic stones. Make the switch to natural at the pre-polisher level instead if you want to do it earlier.

    I have not found a lot of favor in the commonly available blue aotos (2-4k range), have had a couple, they are sloppy to the point that it can interfere with being able to tell what they're doing.

    Best coarser than finisher japanese stones that I've gotten are stones people sold me as finishing stones, but lied about how fine they are (i'm not much for sending things back, esp. something as subjective as a japanese natural stone). They're barely finer than an aoto, but they are harder and cut better and do a good job of prepping for really fine natural stones

    You could also use a novaculite stone, like a hard arkansas, and use it only with soapy water. Novaculite stones have a bad reputation for speed because the novaculite is fairly soft and will break down and be smoother than its grit suggests, BUT, if you have a diamond hone to scuff their surface regularly, they actually cut quite fast, and they don't cut really deep grooves like diamonds or really aggressive synthetics. I've actually used them with good effect on japanese chisels if they have been scuffed regularly, but they will behave like they're not able to cut the steel on those same chisels if they are allowed to settle down and go without being scuffed.

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    Know thyself holli4pirating's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scipio View Post
    There is also the Dalmore Blue, said to be around 2-4K level.
    I had a Dalmore Blue for a while, and I really wouldn't recommend trying to set a bevel with one. Just finding one that is not crazy expensive would be the first big challenge. They are also very hard, so it's difficult to raise a slurry, and they are SLOW cutters. I mean SLOW.

    I have heard but not tried the Amakusa Red can be used, but you may have to do a fair bit of lapping to create a surface that has no inclusions. Others have said they couldn't get a good surface. I have also heard but not tried that the Amakusa White can be used.

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    Try this...I've ordered from these guys before: Amakusa White Natural Medium Stone, Medium Grit Stones
    Northeastern Texas & Southeastern Oklahoma Mentor/Helper...PM me if I can assist you.
    God Bless,
    Scott

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