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  1. #1
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    Default A Beginners Expirience - Questions for the Pros, Advice for other beginner.

    Hey guys! I had a lot to say, and being lazy this morning, I decided to make a youtube shaving vlog entry. Please watch the video.



    The questions are:
    1. Sratch patter/low grit. What is too low? Does it matter if it shaves smooth, and passes the HHT. Does mirror polish, practically, matter?

    2. Norton 4k. Why does it feel so weird (sandy, gritty, dirty, yuck...hate it)? While honing, my blade would pop hairs off the 220, and the 1k. After some time on the 4k, it would barely shave hair off my arm. What gives?

    3. What are some easy ways to polish up scales without replacing them?

    4. What should I be doing in terms of sanitation/sterilization as I restore/practice on these old eBay razors?

    Here are some pictures of the razor I discuss in the video.

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/30692888@N02/4504927371/

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/30692888@N02/4504927371/
    Last edited by bbuehler10; 04-09-2010 at 03:57 PM. Reason: Adding pictures

  2. #2
    Senior Member claytor's Avatar
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    Let me point out I have the two norton combo stones and a bbw and a coticule. I personally find 220 too aggressive unless you have chips to remove. 1000 is a great bevel setter.

    Did you lap your stones? That might be why your 4000 experience wasn't very good. I don't use slurries on my nortons so I'm not really sure if that's why you got that sanding feeling. I think that might be why your bevel looks fuzzy, but it's just a guess.

    Polishing scales depends on the material and its finish. Celluloid you can use maas or a metal polish. Horn you can buff out with neatsfoot oil.

    For sterilization I use barbacide (scales and all). There are many methods and philosophies as far as virii and bacteria. some use alcohol wipes.
    Last edited by claytor; 04-09-2010 at 04:41 PM. Reason: barbarcide, not barbasol.

  3. #3
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    Hi bbuehler10
    Great video ! + good equipment !
    You seem to have all the right gear and seem to be using your hones correctly.
    Firstly i am also a beginner and am not experienced enough to answer All your questions so i will leave that to the more exp members out there.I do know that assessment counts for alot before you choose which hone to use.
    As far as hones go you do not really need to go lower than the 1k hone to set a bevel (using lower grits just cuts time spent honing) but it depends on the job required.If the razor is very rough with alot of damage to the blade then a 220 to start with would be fine. Having looked at your razor ,at first glance it doesn't look all that bad.
    you seem to have proceeded correctly through the hones-and because i don't have a 4k/8k hone i have no idea why it seems so gritty to use.However used correctly it is the right choice and barring your technique in using it should be ok.(maybe a film of you using the 4k hone would help so we can see what your doing).
    There is no rule that says an edge should be mirror finish .It is all a matter of personal taste,and as long as you are happy with it and it shaves ok then fine!(some people say that a mirror finish gives a smoother shave).Remwmber after 4k you are only polishing the edge.
    I do not know how to polish up scales -I'll leave that to other members .
    All in all it seems you did a pretty good job so well done!!
    I've probably missed something but i've said enough-anyway hope this helps in some way.
    Best regards
    Noggs

  4. #4
    Forum mogwai thebigspendur's Avatar
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    There is the old saying about the right tool for the right job. Whenever you hone you are removing metal. The coarser the stone the more metal you remove so you want to use the highest grit you can get away with without of course having to spend an inordinate amount of time to complete the operation.

    For many years the lowest grit hone I had was the Norton 4K and I used it to do everything from setting bevels to taking chips out so it does work. In general depending on the razor (of course) the 1K is great for bevel work and removing tiny microchips and I would reserve the 220 for severe defects in the blade. Once the bevel is set you should not go back past the 4K. Really once the edge looks good and you have a positive result arm hair shaving you can go forward to the 8K class hone.

    I wouldn't worry about the mirror finish on the bevel. I have razors with finishes like that and I have some with a satin finish and they both shave equally well and that is the ultimate test. The scratch pattern will reflect the way it was honed and the characteristics of the hone you used.

    It looks like you have this thing pretty well figured out so it's just a matter of experimentation.

    I'm not sure why you have issues with the 4K. I love it.

    As far as sterilization goes I don't worry about it because with vintage stuff it probably hasn't been used in a long time and after honing and stropping and chemicals used to clean nothing would survive. If you want you can swab it down with alcohol or get some barbicide.
    Every day without fail one should consider himself as dead-Tsunetomo

  5. #5
    Senior Member paco's Avatar
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    Good video and great questions, however I will leave the comments to the more skilled honers as I am only beginning.
    One last note .
    CLEAN YOUR ROOM!!!!!!!!!!!!,
    Consider where you will spend ETERNITY !!!!!!
    Growing Old is a necessity; Growing Up is Not !

  6. #6
    Senior Member blabbermouth hi_bud_gl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bbuehler10 View Post
    Hey guys! I had a lot to say, and being lazy this morning, I decided to make a youtube shaving vlog entry. Please watch the video.



    The questions are:
    1. Sratch patter/low grit. What is too low? Does it matter if it shaves smooth, and passes the HHT. Does mirror polish, practically, matter?
    Scratch pattern just remember FORGET ABOUT IT. MIRROR POLISH DOESNT MATTER. AS FAR as i know only norton 8k makes mirror bevel very high grit most Japanese hones i have used has hazy finish . rain
    2. Norton 4k. Why does it feel so weird (sandy, gritty, dirty, yuck...hate it)? While honing, my blade would pop hairs off the 220, and the 1k. After some time on the 4k, it would barely shave hair off my arm. What gives?
    This is confusing. your are poping airs on 220 and 1k . by the way until today i am unable to do so.Generally advisable don't go lower then 1k level. Can you ? yes necessary NO.
    why 4k feels like that it s made that way remember you don't have to use slurry on synthetic stones(mostly) you said in video you are not useing pressure? are you sure about it?
    after work done on 8k your blade should not pop up the hairs. it should cuts so easily hair falls of to your blade
    3. What are some easy ways to polish up scales without replacing them?
    sanding and polishing special products. i am not pro on this one.
    4. What should I be doing in terms of sanitation/sterilization as I restore/practice on these old eBay razors?
    i use cool care +
    Here are some pictures of the razor I discuss in the video.

    _IGP4815 on Flickr - Photo Sharing!

    _IGP4815 on Flickr - Photo Sharing!
    My advise to you please don't sharpen blade you have put up pictures. Buy ebay junk blades and learn how to sharp straight razor mostly start with hallow ground.
    hope this helps. gl

  7. #7
    Carbon-steel-aholic DwarvenChef's Avatar
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    Your not the only one to have issues with the 4k Norton stone, the white one. With equil use I have all but gone through all of that stone while the 8k side seems to be full size still. And forget using AS steel on it haha it's like scooping sand off the shore... Each pass erodes deeply into the 4k... So I bought a Shapton 3k glass stone to replace it.

    At the end you mentioned a faint scratch pattern, this my be left overs from the diamond you mentioned, Diamond leaves deeper angular scratches while Cro2 is a rounder finishing grit, leaving more of a mirror polish. I save the diamond stuff for kitchen knives that need that extra bite.

    Just my thoughts on your videa questions...

  8. #8
    I Bleed Slurry Disburden's Avatar
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    Were these stones lapped and flattened? I don't see any mention of this and that would answer some of your frustrations. Also the Norton stones need to be soaked in a water bath for about 20 minutes before you use them. They need to stay wet when you're honing on them.

    I use a maker to mark the edge of the razor when I hone to make sure I am removing metal throughout the whole bevel of the razor. This helps a lot, also a microscope helps a lot to see the edge and the scratch pattern removal.

    I don't know why new guys want to hone, I'd stay away from it for a few months until you can shave well without any hard effort, then I would experiment with hones.
    Last edited by Disburden; 04-10-2010 at 02:01 PM.

  9. #9
    Senior Moderator JimmyHAD's Avatar
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    As Lynn has pointed out a number of times, some 4k nortons need to be lapped down an 1/8 of an inch or so and some do not. If you lap it a ways and try it until it gets to a smoother feel you'll get there eventually. Always soak the 1 or the 4 for at least 15 minutes before lapping or honing.
    Be careful how you treat people on your way up, you may meet them again on your way back down.

  10. #10
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    FYI, as stated in my video, I have been straight shaving for four years. Iv'e used everything everything from a small Dovo to a big Wade and Butcher to a Feather. Iv'e got the shave down, and now want to do my own maintenence and restorations.

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