Thread: NaJorton has got me thinking about overhoning with higher grit hones

How many passes do the Honemeister's usually use on the higher grit hones? I.E. 12K Naniwa, 16K shapton, CrOx paddle etc. I'm thinking some of my blades that may seem a tad harsh may be from being overhoned. When I saw how little it took off the 8K in JaNorton to polish/finish it got me thinking/rethinking my process. Any thoughts boys?
Paul

While I'm no honemeister, on the Shapton 16k I do about 15-17 passes, 6-7 on the 30k. Crox rarely more than 10.

It seems to me the Norton 8k isn't super fast, it polishes more than it cuts, so far I'm finding my razors can tolerate a lot of passes on it.

Of course it depends on the razor but on the Naniwa12k about 12 on the Shapton 16k about 15 and the Shapton 30k I use the 3-2-1 or maybe a 3-2-2

This is a dangerous thread though, you have to be very careful when you start thinking in laps counts, in fact not to many years back you would be hard pressed to even find laps counts on SRP other then the Pyramid...

You have to take so many variables into account when honing, just the simple one of hone progression is a big one... If I tell you laps counts as I just did you have to understand that on the Naniwas I hone 1-3-5-8-10-12 so my edge coming off the 10k would be different than someone coming off the 8k or perhaps someone skipping the 5k same as the Shaptons I go 1-2-4-6-8-16-30

I also do those progressions after a 1k Chosera bevel set so all my laps on all those stones are super light finishing style laps I am not chasing sharp everything after the bevel set is all about smooth...

Feel on the hones is still what you need to develop the most

I agree with Glen. I could say that on my Naniwa 12k I'm always between 10 and 15 strokes, however....the reality is that I'm feeling and listening and looking simultaneously.

I may be at 9 strokes, and then all of a sudden the feel of the razor changes on stroke 10, and I see something different happen on stroke 11, and that's it. I may be out to lunch, but I reall believe this. Stroke count is only a ballpark until you get your feel on that stone.

In my opinion, starting at 8K, I don't think overhoning is a problem. As long as you are evenly honing both sides, I don't know whether you can overhone. While it is likely that most here will disagree...

When in doubt, hone some more!

But, remember this is directed to the 8K and above hones. Below that, it is a totally different story.

All I have is a Phig and a surgical black Arkie, which means 50-100 laps for finishing.

On the finishing stones above 8K, I will normally do just 10 no pressure X strokes. This is on the Naniwa SS 12K, Shapton 16K, Sigma 13K and with my naturals just using water. This number has proven to be very reliable and consistent for me. When I teach new guys to hone, the numbers simply provide a basis for repeatable results or gives them the foundation to build their skills from. If the razor is not where I want it, I can always do 3-5 more. I still feel less strokes are better and so far results are proving this for me day in and day out. When using the 8K either as a finisher or before a higher grit stone, 6-7 strokes on carbon blades and 8-10 strokes on stainless blades has worked very well. On the 8K, I can always go back and do a 1-3 or 1-5 pyramid progression to dial in or just try another 3-5 strokes. Stones will definitely tell you that the razor is getting where you want it to go. On the 4K with no pressure, you will feel a little resistance and on the 8K and finishers, you will feel a little sticking.

It really becomes a matter of practice to determine what works best for you. You can definitely take a razor from being able to shave nicely to not being able to shave at all with too many strokes. This should not be that problematic as in most cases, you can just drop down to your previous grit level and bring the razor right back.

Have fun.

+1 on lap counts being a pandora's box. Extra hollow vs wedge will vary the count alot. Hardness of steel.

The thing I notice is that the masters are able to use very few strokes, and the rest of us have to use way more. I can only guess this has to do w/ the quality of the bevel set, and the quality of the subsequent strokes. Lynn & Glenn finish many different methods w/ only 10 strokes on the finisher. I'll be glad when I unlock that door.

Having a good bevel set is really key to getting good results when honing.

The main thing is that if it takes you 15 strokes or 20 strokes and you can get to the result you want on a repeated basis, then finding that approximate number of strokes will really help you as you hone more razors of all kinds, shapes and sizes. The only right way to do things is the way that works best for you. Same with stones. You don't know what you don't try and even then your results may be different from someone elses. I really like this sport!

Have fun.

Originally Posted by pinklather

+1 on lap counts being a pandora's box. Extra hollow vs wedge will vary the count alot. Hardness of steel.

The thing I notice is that the masters are able to use very few strokes, and the rest of us have to use way more. I can only guess this has to do w/ the quality of the bevel set, and the quality of the subsequent strokes. Lynn & Glenn finish many different methods w/ only 10 strokes on the finisher. I'll be glad when I unlock that door.

Well I had been thinking I had been overhoning certain blades (full hollow) I still think that may be the case..
Paul