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Bruno

How not to contact us...

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by , 03-26-2012 at 07:14 AM (1583 Views)
Hey guys,

I thought I'd share this with you, so that you can see some of the people we have to deal with.

A member had an issue with posting classifieds ads. As it turns out, there were a number of items in a separate area, which were moved there because there was an issue with them (for example: the ads did not follow the rules). As it happens, these ads count in the max number of items you can have up for sale. So if we forget to remove them (because they were still under discussion or whatever), you can post less ads. That makes sense, right?

Now this member had a number or razors for sale in a lot, and I inquired about the price of a couple. They were all out of my league so I politely declined. I did not make an offer for any of them. There was 1 vintage (restored, non-perfect) razor that the owner did not have an accurate price for. He based his proposed price on the sale of a mint one that itself was overpriced. So I explained that the price I would expect that blade to fetch was along the line of xyz dollars.

After the PM exchange I forgot all about it. Until yesterday when I got this message (I removed a part with the problem description and the names)

I hope for an answer ASAP and I hope the fact that I am only able to post a single ad has nothing to do with the fact that I've turned down some offers that I received from some moderators for some of my items. Those offers ware simply to low for me to accept and the items in question have been sold for much more than what I was offered by the moderators. I hope there are no hard feelings here and I hope there is not an unwritten rule which says that in order to be able to use the classifieds on SRP fairly you MUST sell your items to the moderators form whatever price they offer to keep them happy. Again anyone please get back to me with an answer and most important do whatever is necessary so that I can place more than one ad as everyone else. Cheers!
Let's look at the above, phrase by phrase:

I hope for an answer ASAP and I hope the fact that I am only able to post a single ad has nothing to do with the fact that I've turned down some offers that I received from some moderators for some of my items. Those offers ware simply to low for me to accept and the items in question have been sold for much more than what I was offered by the moderators.
Ok here he is implying that his problems are cause by petty vindictiveness on my part. That's pretty disappointing.

I hope there are no hard feelings here and I hope there is not an unwritten rule which says that in order to be able to use the classifieds on SRP fairly you MUST sell your items to the moderators form whatever price they offer to keep them happy.
Here is is implying that we have to be bribed into allowing ads to be sold in the classifieds. Like some sort of mobster protection racket. We don't. One of the reasons (among others) that we don't charge for anything is precisely to prevent this sort of discussion.

Again anyone please get back to me with an answer and most important do whatever is necessary so that I can place more than one ad as everyone else.
Translation: nevermind that I just insulted you personally and implied that you guys are institutionally corrupt, get to work so that I can get as much money as fast as possible.

Cheers
Really?

Updated 03-26-2012 at 07:18 AM by Bruno

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Comments

  1. AndrewK's Avatar
    Thank you Bruno for devoting your time and energy here. You're one of the many people here that makes SRP the great place that it is
  2. Pithor's Avatar
    I'm sorry, but I don't see the point in putting this out into the open. I understand being a moderator of a forum of this size, including a section where people sell and buy quite many and sometimes quite valuable items, has its difficulties and can be frustrating at times. However, checking the forum and classifieds regularly, I feel I have a fairly good idea who you are talking about, and now I'm wondering why you chose to bring a private discussion out into the open. Not trying to be a smart ass or nothing, just saying it comes with the territory. I can understand your frustration but why the need to share it?
    BanjoTom and xuz like this.
  3. Bruno's Avatar
    The reason I brought this into the open is that sometimes, people get banned (or have their ads removed or their classifieds permissions revoked etc) as the result of how they interact with us.

    For example, I might have done so for the person sending me the above PM. I didn't, because I am a fairly patient man. But suppose I had done so. I would certainly have been in the right. But you also know that as a rule, we don't discuss banning reasons in public (unless the banning was a result for things done in public).

    The member then goes someplace else, and makes veiled accusations about how he was banned for not selling things to our mods below market value, etc. And barring us speaking out (which we don't) we can't defend ourselves. A cursory glance would show that the person was indeed banned. Add some carefully chosen snippets of the PM exchange, and voila. Another SRP bashfest can ensue . Even without making the accusation of corruption, we can be made to look like we banned the member out of spite.

    In this case, there were no repercussions so I can more easily show an example of the things we get to deal with, and the way they are spun into accusations and bad feelings, and the ease with which such stories could get to live their own life.

    I don't really mind the insults even. Insults only say something about the one making them. I have no patience at all with accusations though. This job is hard enough to do without having to deal with baseless accusations as well. Especially because I can maintain perfect integrity and still get smeared. Rather than getting angry about it, I decided to show how this can happen and how there is nothing we can do about it.
    Cove5440 and Ouiska like this.
    Updated 03-26-2012 at 12:55 PM by Bruno
  4. Deerhunter1995's Avatar
    bruno i agree with ya, you guys do put up with alot of stuff, i remember a member bashing all mods and big guns for discurgaging people from doing things themselfs and instead tryign to get them to buy and pay other people to hone restore ect ect. Well all know thats not tru and neather is this accusation about blocking the classifieds from people that wont sell to you at ur price.
    ZYour a great mod and im happy to be able to intereact with people like you on a daily basis
  5. mjhammer's Avatar
    There is at least one in every crowd, and sadly, the larger the group becomes the more of this type exists.

    It's a law of averages. NO matter how hard you try, there is always going to be the one that maintains they were treated unfairly.

    Trying to 'police' (and I use that word lightly) a generic classified section to ensure adherence to a set of rules is not an easy task, it takes time and effort that largely goes unnoticed and unheralded.

    I have noticed that what was once a price range of 25-50$ has been replaced by 150-350$ postings. I believe the classifieds are becoming a deterent rather than a blessing.

    Once upon a time, folks would refer newbies to the classifieds to get a sharpened, less expensive razor to get started with, this has practically ceased to exist. One can now purchase a brand new Dovo or Boker for less than the advertised price on 90% of the classifieds.

    Tough Job for Bruno!!

    My 2 cents.

    M
  6. gugi's Avatar
    The prices in the classifieds are determined entirely by the buyers and the seller, SRP does not get involved at all either way. Of course, if you want to lower the prices you can always increase the supply by selling your own razors at the low prices you wish to see



    Back on topic here's another example of how some (currently former) members like to contact us. Short background - that member's ad was removed for violating the rules and here's his response to the notification he got (the bleep edits are mine):

    Are you *bleep* kidding me? Do you know how *bleep* long it took me to put that add together?
    Apparently he thought we weren't working hard enough for him, so he immediately sent a second PM to clarify what we ought to do:
    Put it back now
    It turned out that same member had a number of other bannable forum violations as well, like multiple accounts, deceiving members, etc., so it was an easy decision how to handle his case
  7. JoeSomebody's Avatar
    I find it sad and reprehensible how some members act. Things only seem to get worse if there is money involved. I have had nothing but positive interactions with the members and mods on this forum and find that the moderators who so generously DONATE THEIR TIME are above reproach. Please don't let a few bad apples ruin the bunch. (Any time you argue with an idiot you are bound to lose. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience...)

    As for the prices, it is a law of supply and demand. If you quit buying at inflated prices, the market will adjust.
  8. Jimbo7's Avatar
    "There was 1 vintage (restored, non-perfect) razor that the owner did not have an accurate price for. He based his proposed price on the sale of a mint one that itself was overpriced. So I explained that the price I would expect that blade to fetch was along the line of xyz dollars."

    What is meant by "accurate?" I don't understand this to mean that he goofed and made a typo. You're saying he wanted too much for the razor, yes?

    If I was in his position at that moment, I would take it that you're either (a) offering some free advice about how to sell a particular razor; or (b) attempting to horse trade with him. Given that you'd already inquired about prices and noted that they were too high, I lean towards thinking that he assumed you were trying to move his price down. The free advice option doesn't seem the likely one given those facts. If he thought you were trying to horse trade with him, I can see that conversation being complicated for him if a moderator is the other party.

    Considering the reluctance of people to valuate anything on this forum, it would be a little odd to have a moderator, in a position of power, tell me what I would consider my business regarding the amount at which I price my items. I'm just saying that, based on those facts, it could be interpreted as a power play in spite of your good intentions. I'm not trying to apologize for anyone, just trying to increase our collective understanding. I think you've done well to get it on the record and into the open.
    Blazinrazor likes this.
  9. Slartibartfast's Avatar
    Deleting the classifieds would make life so much easier around here....
    gugi, HNSB and Birnando like this.
  10. JimmyHAD's Avatar
    Y'know one thing to take into consideration is that we, the mods, are volunteers. People who haven't walked a mile in our shoes have no idea how much time is consumed handling these issues that come up. If someone reports a post, a PM, a classified ad, we have to discuss it. Once action, or no action is decided upon we have to PM the person who generated the 'problem'. Then we wait for a response and discuss that. Just a routine "please remove your sig", or "no appraisals are allowed" ...... things that are plainly stated in the rules that all agree to when they register, can take 20 or 30 minutes for a mod to deal with from start to finish.

    Not a big deal you say .... well if you've worked your 10 hour shift and are in front of your PC , relaxing and perusing the forum, now you have to deal with this that and the other. Alright, we volunteered for the job and it comes with the territory. Fair enough and we deal with it. OTOH, it is not inexplicable that some of us get frustrated when we are disrespected by people that we are providing a service for.

    As for making an offer for a classified item ..... I've put them up and asked for a given price and had people make offers. It is not an unheard of practice. For me, or any other mod to make an offer is perfectly fine AFAIC ..... as long as the offer doesn't include a promise of favoritism or a threat of disciplinary action if it isn't accepted. The individual in the blog post responded to all of the mods with innuendo that many, if not all of us, considered insulting. Try to do a guy a favor and what happens ...... Cast not your pearls before swine.
    gssixgun, zib, Dllandry and 3 others like this.
  11. carlmaloschneider's Avatar
    I do hope the comment about deleting the classifieds was a joke and doesn't happen. As strange as it may seem I actually trust people around here, rather than at that place where you 'win' things, although I did 'win' my first razor and it was excellent. I've bought three razors here (one in the classifieds and the others were offered via PMs) and have been really happy with the whole process.

    If anyone were to ask me where to buy their first straight razor, I'd say (and I have said) here, simply based on my positive experience and the fact that you guys know what you're talking about. I don't offer see statements like 'I found it in an estate and I haven't tested it so don't know if it shaves well, but it looks good'. :-)
  12. Bruno's Avatar
    It was a general remark, indicating that the classifieds do cause a lot of headaches and private discussions.
    The classifieds are not going away.
  13. sarahbella's Avatar
    I just reconsidered my new title as Moderator of the Ladies Corner. j/k

    Happy to be a part of this fine group of Mods! SRP is a great forum with very friendly members, happy to be here. Thanks for the post Bruno
  14. Jimbo's Avatar
    It is an unfortunate fact of life on internet forums that people who are meant to moderate and facilitate forum discussion always end up on the policing end of that spectrum due to the disproportionate amount of time needed to deal with a small yet highly annoying proportion of the membership.

    So rather than being free to distribute the years of knowledge and wisdom they have collected throughout the threads, facilitate interesting and stimulating discussion within the threads, and help members with genuine issues, they end up drawing attention as "keepers of rules" which in my mind is such a disappointing and misrepresentational view of such an important and repsect-worthy group of individuals.

    To make matters worse, in the interests of the forum most of the time the actual intercourse between said minority and moderators is cleaned up or deleted, and so people (as they do) form their own interpretation of why member x or member y is no longer with us. That interpretation usually involves police states, heavy handedness, breaches of human rights, unconstitutional behaviours.

    Mods get a bad rap, but they are the hardest working people around here.

    James.
  15. Bruno's Avatar
    Interesting that you should say this, but then again, you have been on this side of the thin blue line
    On average, I post more in the administrative forums than in the public forum. Make no mistake, I like doing what I do here. However, I would enjoy it if we had less 'work' to deal with so that I could spend more time in the workshop forum, or in my actual workshop.